A few years ago, the prospect of doing a Verzuz episode against another comedian was brought up to Katt Williams. “It’s almost cheating for me. I have over ten specials,” Williams told Baltimore radio host Perisa Nicole. “I don’t have to pick but two jokes from each special, and I’ve already deaded anyone whose last name isn’t Pryor.”
Williams is now on his 13th special, Woke Foke, which only further reinforces his point: The 53-year-old has a vast body of work that features a remarkably varied approach to joke writing. When he appeared at Vulture Festival in November for a live taping of Good One: A Podcast About Jokes — his second appearance on the show — we discussed, among other things, the stories behind three of the best-known jokes from his earliest specials.
You can read the excerpts of those conversations below and listen to the complete interview on Good One wherever you get your podcasts.
The “Everyday I’m Hustlin” Opening, American Hustle, 2007
Williams comes out to the Rick Ross anthem. Then, for three minutes, he introduces increasingly absurd situations in which the song would be played (at the library, at the grocery store) and has the DJ repeat it while he acts out the scenario.
How do you feel watching yourself?
I get on my nerves.
Do you remember coming up with that idea?
Yeah. I believe that’s probably the only joke that I stole. I had the joke written — I wanted to do a bit where I play the song and then discuss all the iterations of it. And I had this comedian I was working with at the time, and she was like, “You know what you should do? Keep bringing the song back.” And I was like, “That is fucking brilliant! Just keep bringing it back?” She was like, “Yeah, the same song over and over again.” Then right after I did it, somebody came over and was like, “You know, somebody else does this joke and they’re really, really great.” It was J.B. Smoove, who is a magnificent fucking comedian, but I hadn’t met him and didn’t know his work.
The thing about it that’s specifically you is the physicality.
I appreciate physicality as a part of the craft. The ability to let somebody watch you present what you’re trying to present is very important — and not in any joke in particular. That’s just one of the levels that has to be dealt with before a joke is ready for consumption. I’ve tried to do that with my specials: add a piece of the physical culture to what I’m doing. And yeah, it costs money — this song was $80,000 — but it also conveys the message. It’s a connector. The people that fuck with me fuck with me because I’m actually living this experience that I’m narrating. That involves emotion and feeling, and that’s what music is all about, so it’s important.
What does Rick Ross think of the bit?
Who cares?
Poor Little Tink Tink, It’s Pimpin’ Pimpin’, 2008
In a bit about believing in yourself, Williams tells the story of an unnamed athlete — in actuality, Oscar Pistorius — who lost his legs, was given metal replacements, and then attempted to compete in the Olympics, only to be treated poorly by the other competitors and judges.
You’re laughing at this one.
I think it’s funny.
How did you go from originally seeing the story of that athlete, Oscar Pistorius, to writing a thing like “Tink Tink”?
To be someone who can inspire others first requires that you are inspired by others, so I gather inspiration from places, and that’s what helps me to do what it is I’m doing. Yesterday, I was at this event for the GQ Men of the Year. While I’m there, this guy, Hunter [Woodhall] — he’s an Olympic athlete — comes to me and goes, “Katt, I need to tell you this story. I was born without my legs, and I grew up listening to your ‘Tink! Tink!’ joke, and that’s what let me know that I could do this.” That is what the fuck I’m doing it for! When I’m fucking writing, I’m hoping that somehow it’s what somebody needs. And a lot of times, it doesn’t happen where you think it’s gonna happen. That’s why I don’t argue with God about the message. Whatever is to be said, I try to say it.
Did you follow the story of Pistorius afterward?
Understand: My God is the greatest comedian. It doesn’t matter how it’s set up, he’s gonna do it funnier, and he always comes through. When I did the joke, I was like, I hope I didn’t fuck with [Pistorius’s] spirit. Lord didn’t let me worry about it.
Michael Jackson, The Pimp Chronicles Pt. 1, 2006
Williams discussed the allegations against Michael Jackson, rebutting many of the common defenses of the pop star.
This joke helped build your reputation as a person who’s willing to talk about things that others were not. Did you get pushback?
I shouldn’t have told it, honestly. These things are the reason that the enemy decides to go ahead and let you be famous: your ability to tear down your own kind, no matter how high they are. On the other hand, my job is to be funny and to voice the opinion of a group that doesn’t get to have their opinion out there.
As a Black man, if you don’t love yourself, you don’t love me, so those were the jokes of a guy that was hurt by an icon. The fact that, years later, Janet Jackson says she still loved me despite the jokes that I told about her brother is one of the most magnificent things. I say a lot of hilarious shit, but it costs me every time. I’m never unscathed in these situations.
Is that something you struggle with when writing material?
Oh, don’t get it twisted — I have no regrets. In each situation, I am trying to do what the Black superhero in my position would do. If that works out well, then glory be to God. But if it’s fucked up, I take it and move on to the next thing, because I know that that’s what the Black superhero would have done.
Your specials often open with you being introduced as “the undisputed king of underground comedy.” What does that title mean to you? When you work with a place like Netflix, do you feel like you’ve retained it?
You’re saying the “underground king” thing is because of lack of mainstream support and the fact that I was able to do what I was able to do without that support is how I got that position — and that now that I’ve received some support, does that take away from that? Probably.
But I’m anti-Establishment, so I can never be “the Establishment.” Like, even if I’m at the Diddy party, I’m there to tell. I’m there to see who the fuck is in here and what y’all get from being in here. Nobody likes to have me around. I’m there for bad intentions. I ain’t gotta leave before I see who comes, because that’s my job as an unbiased reporter to the people — and I said coming in that that’s what I was gonna do.
