A conversation with Nancy Bisaha about the origins of the idea of "Europe" as a place of identity and not just geography. One of its first theorists was the Italian humanist Aeneas Piccolomini (later Pope Pius II), who was in part reacting to the fall of Constantinople to the Ottoman Turks. The problem of whom to include and exclude as Europeans was there from the start. We talk about Aeneas himself and the siege of the City.
